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Introduction: Passukim 1-4
- Yirmiyahu- from the Kohanim and lived in ענתת which was near Yirushalayim but far enough in order for him to escape sometimes. (He wasn't close [in the palace] like Yishayahu was.)
-Prophesied from the 13th year of Yoshiyahu until the galut- the destruction of the Temple/ until the 11th year of Tzedkiyahu/ 586BCE
Passuk 5: Hashem says to Yirmiyahu, "Before you were created, I knew you in the womb. Before you were born, you were sanctified for the nations." Hashem is telling Yirmiyahu that he was destined to be a prophet.
Passuk 6: Yirmiyahu's response was, "But I'm only a נער " - I am still being trained. You're telling me that I'm gonna be the main navi? I'm a נער, inexperienced and untrained right now... I'm not ready yet. (Objection #1 )
Hashem's Argument #1 (Passuk 7): Don't say you're inexperienced, I'm gonna be your guide
Hashem's Argument #2 (Passuk 8): Don't be scared of them because I will save you
Sign/אות (Passuk 9): Touches his lip- Behold, I'm giving you words into your mouth.
Sign of the first two arguments-- resolve the issue
Mission (Passuk 10): To uproot, destroy, to build and to plant
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Things to Consider: (so you guys will be able to post a comment)
-How does this Hakdasha compare with Yishayahu's (if it was a Hakdasha..) thus-far? Moshe's?
-What does Hashem mean in Passuk 5? Does this conflict with free will?
- Why do you think that Yirmiyahu chooses to identify himself as a נער? What is the significance in that?
1. So far, he reminds me more of Moshe then Yeshayahu. The same protesting type of manner. Now, we must ask ourselves if it is good he protested, because it shows he is humble, or bad, because he is defying G-d?
ReplyDelete2. I don't think it conflicts with free will. I mean, yeah, some people are "destined for greatness." Like Batman. He was just meant to go from Bruce to Batman... although it's different because G-d didn't tell him to. And anyways, even if G-d says that he was destined to do this, it doesn't mean he can refuse. He can still refuse his destiny if he wants too.
3. Well, a youth shows that you are not someone who older people will listen to. It also shows that you are not as experienced as you could be. So maybe he is saying all of this at once.
--please note that I wrote all of this in one post. Posting each answer separately is confusing! Please refrain!
Zahava- I was about to put the answer separately but then i saw your post and didn't. Aren't you proud of me? :)
ReplyDelete1. By the hakdasha of Moshe Rabbenu, Moshe protested against being a navi because he didn't think that he had the physical capacity to do what needed to be done concerning the nation. By Yeshayahu's Hakdasha, Yeshayahu protested because he thought of himself as too impure to be the navi for the people. Here, by the hakdasha of Yirmiyahu, he says that it is because he is too inexperienced and untrained and he wouldn't know what to do. I agree with Zahava that Yirmiyahu reminds me more of Moshe than Yeshayahu because both Yirmiyahu and Moshe were worried about their physical capability to do what was needed. Yeshayahu was not unsure of his capabilities, just of his purity and being the right person for the job.
2. Answering the second part of the question first, I think that this might actually interfere with free will. we have always been told that HaShem does everything so that it will not interfere, but in reality, how would you feel if you were suddenly called by HaShem when you were just a teenager and were told out of nowhere that you no longer had control over your own life. He became a "slave to the people" in a way. His life was dedicated to them and he had no say in it. As for what HaShem was saying, I think it was something along the lines of "Even before you were born, you already had your life planned out for you. This is what was planned."
3. I think that it's like you said in your post. He was inexperienced and untrained like a young boy. We see this word used like this in more than one place in Tanach and this one doesn't seem so different.
I am very proud of you Mirel!
ReplyDelete2. So maybe there is a different way of understanding what "destined" means. Maybe G-d isn't saying, "I already wrote it down to bad." Maybe, you know, since we say G-d knows everything, G-d is just saying, "I've seen that you will." Not "You have to" but "I know you will."
1. Interesting point, Zahava, you brought up. That's what I, too, wonder. Why are these people defying G-d? G-d is sending them a message telling them that they are to be leaders and gives them a mission and they turn it down? Really? Wouldn't anyone die for the opportunity? And isn't G-d having faith in you enough? If G-d has faith, surely you should have faith.. What's with all of this hesitation? There are other ways to be humble without saying you don't want to do it. Like, "Thank you, this is a great honor. Though I have never before even imagined that I would be the one to do this, I will take this role upon myself with the knowledge that it was appointed to me by the Almighty and that H' will be with me in whatever I endure and that He/She/It has faith in me.
ReplyDelete2. Not like this has to do with anything at all, but I'm not totally sure that Batman was destined for greatness. Bruce Wayne could have gone anywhere. It's a wonder he became Batman- a great wonder. I mean, it makes sense and all, true, but I'm just saying he could have easily just been a great rich boy. What I don't get though is how H' could be planning this before there was anything to plan? H' knew that he was going to be an awesome guy?
3. Well, a youth shows that you are not someone who older people will listen to. It also shows that you are not as experienced as you could be. So maybe he is saying all of this at once.
Racheli---
ReplyDelete1. I agree with what you were saying and like how nicely you put that Racheli.
2. Okay, okay, back track. Bruce Wayne might have grown up to be a bratty rich kid but let's get serious. For one thing, his parents were raising him to be nice remember. (See first movie, train seen, right before theyre murdered) Also, his parents were murdered and that all led him to become destined... well wait maybe your right. It just kind of happened didnt it... Well, either way certain people knew he would be great, but they never forced him to be great! Like G-d with Yirmiyahu!
3. sounds eerily similar!
2.
ReplyDeleteI think that it does not conflict with free will since although it was his destiny, he still had a say and was able to express his fears and that he is not fit for this. I think free will and destiny work together since God knew that he will be fit to be a Navi when the right time will come and that is his purpose in life.
- Yirmiyahu was trying to express that he is unexperienced and without any knowledge and only in the beginning of his learning. This is very similar to a naar who at is only in the beginning of his life, not knowimg too much about life and not having very much experience like someone older. Yirmiyahu felt like a naar since he felt like he was only in the beginning of his training and that there would be someone else more experienced who could do a better job than him, just as in life: When there is a doctor who is older he most likely has more experience in his field of work that a doctor who is still studying to be a doctor and does not have a lot of experience.
ReplyDeleteI think that Pasuk 5 does kind of conflict with free will (I dont think that sentence makes sense....), but on the other hand it does not. I think rather than have a conflict with free will its more convincing or giving Yirmiyahu a very persuasive argument to agree to being a profit. Yirmiyahu could have argued with G-d and kept on saying no. True G-d probably would not have let him give up because as it says he was destined to be a profit, but he still could have.
ReplyDeleteI am not really sure if this contradicts free will and I am having trouble deciding which side I think, but then again I have big issues with the free will topic in general.
"What I don't get though is how H' could be planning this before there was anything to plan? H' knew that he was going to be an awesome guy?"
ReplyDeleteHaShem DOES know everything, right? That's what we were always taught, no?